July 9 - 11 : SQ presents new F and J seats

[viraj735]

For those who really hate the diagonal sleep position in J, I think they really have little standing to complain anyways if they are unwilling to pay for that additional seat pitch by paying for Suites. Why shouldn't SQ charge more for more seat pitch?

As you know, not all aircraft are fitted with Suites.

Just flew SIN-SFO in F. The pitch is still inadequate when sleeping (I'm only 5"10) relative to their competitors.

[Stratoliner777]

The new J cabin looks nice, but like others have said, it's a bit inconvenient that you have to get up and flip the back of the seat over for the bed...although that may not matter to some.

I'm surprised that more was not done to differentiate F from J, I was expecting that the new F would move closer to Suites in features...e.g. an EK style enclosed 'mini-suite'...

Overall, more evolutionary than revolutionary, which can be a good thing. I was however hoping for more, particularly from the new F. For some reason, the way the 8 seats are set up with partial dividers (both in the new and current F in the 77W), they appear wider than long (in photos and videos), and hence seem less capacious than other fully-enclosed F suites, or other F cabins with lower dividers.

[Short Final]

As you know, not all aircraft are fitted with Suites.

Just flew SIN-SFO in F. The pitch is still inadequate when sleeping (I'm only 5"10) relative to their competitors.

Viraj, yep, I am aware. But if these folks complaining were willing to pay for the pitch, their complaint would be why more planes are not fitted with Suites or F.

Instead, they complain about the J seat, basically expecting SQ to give them more pitch in J even if they are unwilling to pay for it.

[Durian]

The new J cabin looks nice, but like others have said, it's a bit inconvenient that you have to get up and flip the back of the seat over for the bed...although that may not matter to some.

I'm surprised that more was not done to differentiate F from J, I was expecting that the new F would move closer to Suites in features...e.g. an EK style enclosed 'mini-suite'...

Overall, more evolutionary than revolutionary, which can be a good thing. I was however hoping for more, particularly from the new F. For some reason, the way the 8 seats are set up with partial dividers (both in the new and current F in the 77W), they appear wider than long (in photos and videos), and hence seem less capacious than other fully-enclosed F suites, or other F cabins with lower dividers.

I eventually got invited after sending a "I-am-not-invited-I-am-a-faithful-PPS-how-can-you-do-that-to-me" email
The big plus of the long haul J is the mattress. First, no contact between skin and leather (following question then is, are the mattresses washed after every flight ?) and additional layer means more comfort. I really like this seat. I noticed overall there's less leather on the surroundings around the seat, the sales guy explained, especially on the right side of the seat (for a A left seat), leather has been removed and it's fabric now, but padded, so it's more comfy to rest your head there... well done. Overall the set up a Jetquay was odd, the space with the J seat in front was very narrow, smaller than it actually is on the plane. For the F, I find this class useless anyway. I've treated myself to a Suite trip one-way with my KF miles next year but would not spend the miles on a non-enclosed P cabin, how different can it be from a already very good J class ?

[CarbonMan]

As you know, not all aircraft are fitted with Suites.

Just flew SIN-SFO in F. The pitch is still inadequate when sleeping (I'm only 5"10) relative to their competitors.

Yes, I concur. I'm similar in height and with added large feet, the foot hole becomes quite restrictive, making it impossible to cross one's feet. If the new foot hole is about 3" higher and wider, I think it'll be just great. No issues about sleeping diagonally.

[Stratoliner777]

I eventually got invited after sending a "I-am-not-invited-I-am-a-faithful-PPS-how-can-you-do-that-to-me" email
The big plus of the long haul J is the mattress. First, no contact between skin and leather (following question then is, are the mattresses washed after every flight ?) and additional layer means more comfort. I really like this seat. I noticed overall there's less leather on the surroundings around the seat, the sales guy explained, especially on the right side of the seat (for a A left seat), leather has been removed and it's fabric now, but padded, so it's more comfy to rest your head there... well done. Overall the set up a Jetquay was odd, the space with the J seat in front was very narrow, smaller than it actually is on the plane. For the F, I find this class useless anyway. I've treated myself to a Suite trip one-way with my KF miles next year but would not spend the miles on a non-enclosed P cabin, how different can it be from a already very good J class ?

Ah, good job getting access to that event!!!

True, the advantage with the flip-down seat is the additional mattress layer. I think that for optimal comfort, a seat that doesn't do that needs a separate duvet/mattress cover added on, provided it doesn't get too hot.

And I also agree with you that given how good J is, there's much less reason to spring for F. I still think they could have differentiated F further to make it more unique.

[Handiman]

The SQ J seat is in a way a herringbone for sleep and face-forward for seating. The advantage is that everybody gets a full isle access and the seat doesn't look as cloistered up some other airlines. To me, this is a good compromise.

To have a full foot width will require a much bigger pitch resulting in fewer seats (hence higher prices) or more seats per row (hence, no more full width aisle access).

Of course, once can go for row 11. And I usually do.

U know to get 11 ain't easy , I hope to have the chances soon

Truly I don't understand why people call this position sleeping "diagonally" - maybe the physiology of some don't agree with it and it makes it harder to sleep for them.

Didn't see too many people bitching about 2A and 2F on the old 744's though. Those were also "angled" relative to forward motion.....

Agree, its all in the mind. I just wished the foot hole was bigger in the new seats so we don't need too diagonal too much as it also makes the seat belts uncomfortable at waist as its aligned with the seats. I am only 5’9 and with big fat legs , and I never been on SQ 744 2A or F but I assume she don't have this kind of small foot holes ?

IMHO :

When the current J seat is "bed mode" some find that there isn't enough head or shoulder room at the top of the seat because of the box (the footwell from the seat behind). Said footwells are also extremely narrow thus adding to the problem.

CX's new J doesn't have this issue as the seat is built around the diagonal sleeping position. There is ample room head-to-toe. It seems like SQ just made accommodations for the diagonal sleeping position as an afterthought.

Absolutely agree with your opinions. Thankfully the new seats had more space as it was the same width measurement as the seats.

For those who really hate the diagonal sleep position in J, I think they really have little standing to complain anyways if they are unwilling to pay for that additional seat pitch by paying for Suites. Why shouldn't SQ charge more for more seat pitch?

I think nobody hates it, and not being bitchy for sleeping "diagonally" am grateful to be able to seat in J which is a dream of many at EY. Well, everybody is free to comment here right ? SQ doing well by updating its product.. just sad that they came out with the tiny foot holes again at J, and true to say if we don't like SQ product , pls just find another carrier.

Yes, I concur. I'm similar in height and with added large feet, the foot hole becomes quite restrictive, making it impossible to cross one's feet. If the new foot hole is about 3" higher and wider, I think it'll be just great. No issues about sleeping diagonally.

totally agree

And of course these are just my opinions, and please CMIIW. I love SQ and thats the reasons I am in this forum, and for me what makes SQ more than an airline.. no 1 is her cabin crews.

[B727]

IMHO :

Love the drawings, Handiman!

I never did fall in love with SQ's "widest J seats in the sky" in spite of doing quite a few SQ 308s on them.

But I'm willing to give the new J seats a chance when they start flying

[SQflyergirl]

IMHO :

I don't know about uncomfortable though. You look pretty happy in those seats. , smiling and all.

I would do something about building some mass in your lower body. I hear running helps - builds up thighs and calves.

[FN-GM]

I hear running helps - builds up thighs and calves.

Would probably have to grow some feet first

[SMK77]

...but would not spend the miles on a non-enclosed P cabin, how different can it be from a already very good J class...

I recommend to fly a couple of decent First Class (hard) products: LX new F on the A330, LH new F on the A380. You could also try NH new F or QF F on the A380.

All these products are not enclosed suites and are miles ahead of the average SQ seat.

Most frequent (F-)flyers prefer a private but open space and SQ is not selling more seats in Suite just because they have doors.

As a matter of fact, SQ can't even fetch any premium for Suites anymore over F and Suites is eating up twice the space. Go figure...

[StarG]

Great looking sketches, Handiman!

Here's a comparison of current and the updated 77W products.
Top brochure is of the updated products.



So First Class gained 1" to its IFE screens, now 24". (Suites' screens are 23" like current First).
Seat recline in J is now greater than in F! 132 degrees vs 130 degrees.
Economy recline is same as before.

[j.lin]

I recommend to fly a couple of decent First Class (hard) products: LX new F on the A330, LH new F on the A380. You could also try NH new F or QF F on the A380.

All these products are not enclosed suites and are miles ahead of the average SQ seat.

Most frequent (F-)flyers prefer a private but open space and SQ is not selling more seats in Suite just because they have doors.

As a matter of fact, SQ can't even fetch any premium for Suites anymore over F and Suites is eating up twice the space. Go figure...

I have tried LX new F, it was so much better than the current SQ F. I believe the LH new F on A380 is very similar to LX F. Have not tried QF and NH yet, but I am putting CX F and EK F as priority

[milehighj]

Here's my 2 cents about what a good F seat should deliver. Since nowadays you can easily get a flat-bed and decent sleep in J, F needs to offer:

(a) a seat or bed space big enough where a travelling couple can comfortably hang out together,
and/or,
(b) a feeling of proper privacy by way of having doors.

Based on my recent experience:

SQ Suites: (a) yes, (b) yes
SQ current F: (a) no, (b) no
EK A380/77W F: (a) no, (b) yes
QF A380 F: (a) yes, (b) no
BA F: (a) no, (b) no

SQ New F: (a) maybe, (b) no

For my money, if both (a) and (b) are no, I may as well be in J...

[SMK77]

SQ current F: (a) no, (b) no

SQ New F: (a) maybe, (b) no

How can the outcome for a) be different for both seats occupying the same space?

The question was: do people really need doors? LX new F, QF F and others are offering more than enough privacy without the need for doors.

Doors slow down service, make it more difficult to interact with crew and if the space is too enclosed the feel of space gets lost.