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Old 26th July 2010, 07:52 AM   #1
FN-GM
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Default Why are all Singapore Airlines 777-200ER but some with derated engines?

Hi,

Sorry i did look on the forums for this but i couldn't find it.

I am just wondering why SQ decided to purchase 777-200ER and degrade the engines on allot of them so they perform like a 777-200? Why didn't they purchase x amount of 777-200ER and x amount of 777-200?

Is the answer purely so they can convert them back to a 777-200ER if need be? or is there another reason?

Thanks
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Old 26th July 2010, 09:03 AM   #2
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It's not only the engines that are derated. The max takeoff weight of the aircraft is also derated. That reduced both purchase prices and operating costs (landing fees). The possibility of increasing thrust and MTOW by paying some money and doing some paperwork not only gave SQ some flexibility, but also greatly increased the resale value of the aircraft (compared to buying 777-200s) which is paying off now.
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Old 27th July 2010, 11:56 AM   #3
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This is a very smart decision of SQ, you can see many airlines are looking for SQ's 772ER, but none for CX's 772

Do you know the fuel capacity are the same for 777-200(not derated) and 777-200ER?
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Old 29th July 2010, 03:15 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FN-GM View Post
Hi,

Sorry i did look on the forums for this but i couldn't find it.

I am just wondering why SQ decided to purchase 777-200ER and degrade the engines on allot of them so they perform like a 777-200? Why didn't they purchase x amount of 777-200ER and x amount of 777-200?

Is the answer purely so they can convert them back to a 777-200ER if need be? or is there another reason?

Thanks
DEGRADED???!?!?! LOL!!!!
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Old 29th July 2010, 03:27 AM   #5
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DEGRADED???!?!?! LOL!!!!
Of course, the OP meant derated, not degraded.
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Old 29th July 2010, 04:09 AM   #6
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Yer sorry about that

What gain do they get by derating them appose to leaving them as standard ER?
Why didn't they do this with the 777-300's?

Thank you
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Old 29th July 2010, 04:28 AM   #7
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Do you know the fuel capacity are the same for 777-200(not derated) and 777-200ER?
The Boeing manufactured 772s and 772ERs have different fuel capacities between them. SQ's degraded 772s and 772ERs have no difference in their fuel capacity.

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What gain do they get by derating them appose to leaving them as standard ER?
Can't say for sure there. Their fuel capacity is the same, so I think the MTOW of the a/cs would be the same between the 772 and 772ER. The only reason I can think of is the fuel consumption of the a/c on the degraded 772s would be more suitable for short haul trips compared to flying a fully rated 772ER.

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Why didn't they do this with the 777-300's?
The 773 and 773ERs are completely different with different engines( for SQ) and some major structural differences. Moreover, 773ER wasn't available when SQ got their 773s.
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Old 29th July 2010, 04:41 AM   #8
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I think they also reduced MTOW which can equal lower landing fees. The inspection and maintenance intervals will also likely be longer on the "derated" Trents.
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Old 29th July 2010, 05:24 AM   #9
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I think they also reduced MTOW which can equal lower landing fees. The inspection and maintenance intervals will also likely be longer on the "derated" Trents.
That's correct. The purchase prices were also lower for both the frames and the engines. If SQ (or a later owner) would like to, they can pay the difference to Boeing and to RR for higher MTOW and thrust, respectively.
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Old 29th July 2010, 06:42 AM   #10
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Thanks for all people who have posted

Quote:
The 773 and 773ERs are completely different with different engines( for SQ) and some major structural differences. Moreover, 773ER wasn't available when SQ got their 773s.
Ah i didnt know that. One question thats going slightly off topic. Can a pilot who pilots the 777 pilot all 3 types SQ have. Do they have a generic type rating. Can a 777 pilot operate the 777-200, 777-200ER, 777-300 & 777-300ER? Or because some have different engines does this not make it possible?

Thanks very much
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Old 29th July 2010, 08:15 AM   #11
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yes they can

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Thanks for all people who have posted



Ah i didnt know that. One question thats going slightly off topic. Can a pilot who pilots the 777 pilot all 3 types SQ have. Do they have a generic type rating. Can a 777 pilot operate the 777-200, 777-200ER, 777-300 & 777-300ER? Or because some have different engines does this not make it possible?

Thanks very much
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Old 30th July 2010, 08:03 PM   #12
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Can't say for sure there. Their fuel capacity is the same, so I think the MTOW of the a/cs would be the same between the 772 and 772ER.
There is a 100,000 lbs difference in the MTOW of the B772 and B772ER. Surprising, since there is no structural limitations to the B772 to not carry the difference in the MTOW. Just a paper limitation.
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Old 30th July 2010, 08:28 PM   #13
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There is a 100,000 lbs difference in the MTOW of the B772 and B772ER. Surprising, since there is no structural limitations to the B772 to not carry the difference in the MTOW. Just a paper limitation.
If by "B772" you mean SQ's derated 777-200ERs, then you're right, there are no structural differences. If you mean 777-200s, then you're mistaken, there are substantial structural differences. If 777s that Boeing built as 777-200s cannot be upgraded to 777-200ERs. SQ had Boeing build 777-200ERs for them and then bought them as 777-200s so that they can be uprated later (for more money).
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Old 30th July 2010, 11:44 PM   #14
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If by "B772" you mean SQ's derated 777-200ERs, then you're right, there are no structural differences. If you mean 777-200s, then you're mistaken, there are substantial structural differences. If 777s that Boeing built as 777-200s cannot be upgraded to 777-200ERs. SQ had Boeing build 777-200ERs for them and then bought them as 777-200s so that they can be uprated later (for more money).
Yup, I meant SQ's "B772"s. If I'm not mistaken, Boeing built B772s have no centre tanks in them.
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Old 31st July 2010, 12:51 AM   #15
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Yup, I meant SQ's "B772"s. If I'm not mistaken, Boeing built B772s have no centre tanks in them.
All of SQ's 777-200s have centre tanks because Boeing built them as 777-200ERs.
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