A380/77W: route and equipment rumours

[LukeGT]

Originally Posted by zvezda

I previously advocated 3x daily SIN-FRA service using 777-300ERs with one continuing to JFK. Recently, I've been thinking more about this. In my opinion, SQ would do better to add new new nonstop service to destinations that have Star Alliance hubs like BRU and VIE. I know SQ tried both BRU and VIE back in the 1990s, but now they can let their Star Alliance partners sell code-share tickets and provide some feed. If SQ can fill a WhaleJet to ZRH, they can fill a 777-200ER or A350-900 to VIE.

Moreover, flying to VIE, would offer a very capillar coverage of eastern european destination enojying OS codeshares.
VIE could be quite interesting. Not sure about BRU, because of CDG and AMS service.

[Nick C]

Originally Posted by zvezda

I previously advocated 3x daily SIN-FRA service using 777-300ERs with one continuing to JFK. Recently, I've been thinking more about this. In my opinion, SQ would do better to add new new nonstop service to destinations that have Star Alliance hubs like BRU and VIE. I know SQ tried both BRU and VIE back in the 1990s, but now they can let their Star Alliance partners sell code-share tickets and provide some feed. If SQ can fill a WhaleJet to ZRH, they can fill a 777-200ER or A350-900 to VIE.

Maybe BER can be restarted with BBI or maybe to DUS as a tag on from VIE?

[zvezda]

Originally Posted by Nick C

Maybe BER can be restarted with BBI or maybe to DUS as a tag on from VIE?

Berlin has been spectacularly unsuccessful as a long-haul destination.* DUS makes a little more sense, but a fifth-freedom tag to DUS (or BBI) from VIE would greatly annoy both LH and OS with little benefit. A tag without fifth-freedom rights would be offer minimal economic benefit. In my opinion, it would be better to make a code-sharing deal with OS to sell some of the seats. It's easy to imagine that OS might want to offer SIN as a destination -- even on SQ metal.

* A quick look at the Star Alliance timetable shows the only nonstop flights operated by Star Alliance carriers between Berlin and anywhere outside Europe are 4x weekly to CAI and 5x weekly to EWR. By comparison, DUS supports ADA 2x weekly, AYT 2x weekly, CAI 1x daily, ORD 1x daily, ADB 1x weekly, ASR 2x weekly, SZF 1x weekly, YYZ 5x weekly, and TZX 1x weekly. Excluding the flights to the asian part of Turkey, DUS has about double the flying to non-european airports as Berlin. VIE has 5x weekly to AMM, 3x weekly to TSE, 5x weekly to GYD, 1x daily to BKK, 6x weekly to PEK, 2x daily to CAI, 10x weekly to DAM, 6x weekly to DEL, 1x daily to DXB, 5x weekly to EBL, 1x weekly to LXR, 5x weekly to BOM, 1x daily to JFK, 1x weekly to SSH, 5x weekly to IKA, 2x daily to TLV, 1x daily to NRT, 6x weekly to YYZ, 5x weekly to TIP, and 1x daily to IAD, plus a raft of flights to asian Turkey and several flights to the Caucasus. Excluding flights to Europe, Turkey, and the Caucasus, the total Star Alliance flights per week are: Berlin 9, Dusseldorf 19, and Vienna 126.

[nursalimLPP]

Sq should take in 747-8 to replace all exsiting 744 routes no more problems...

[zvezda]

Originally Posted by nursalimLPP

Sq should take in 747-8 to replace all exsiting 744 routes no more problems...

Huh??? All existing 744 routes? You mean SIN-NRT-LAX and SIN-FRA-JFK? Or are you including SIN-MEL too? SIN-MEL will get the JumboJet only for the northern winter. The following year it's a good bet to get WhaleJet service. SIN-FRA is also a good bet to get WhaleJet service. Buying a new aircraft type without fleet commonality just to serve one or two routes rarely makes sense.

The Japanese government, through their restrictive protectionist policies, are hurting the Japanese people far more than they are helping JL and NH. Eventually, they will be enlightened.

[Nick C]

Originally Posted by zvezda

Berlin has been spectacularly unsuccessful as a long-haul destination.* DUS makes a little more sense, but a fifth-freedom tag to DUS (or BBI) from VIE would greatly annoy both LH and OS with little benefit. A tag without fifth-freedom rights would be offer minimal economic benefit. In my opinion, it would be better to make a code-sharing deal with OS to sell some of the seats. It's easy to imagine that OS might want to offer SIN as a destination -- even on SQ metal.

How about linking up one of the Nordic terminators with something similar to MXP-BCN. Some detour but allows for consolidation SIN-VIE-CPH?

[zvezda]

Originally Posted by Nick C

How about linking up one of the Nordic terminators with something similar to MXP-BCN. Some detour but allows for consolidation SIN-VIE-CPH?

Tags rarely work. Look how SQ have less than half as many tags now as they did ten years ago. Other airlines have also been reducing tag services.

The best available aircraft for SIN-CPH would be the A330-200. Soon it will be the 787-8. The smaller capacity would drive up RASM and allow for an increase in frequency, which would further drive up RASM. Neither seem likely to ever join SQ's fleet. :-(

If I were in charge of fleet planning at SQ, I would order a dozen or so 787-8s in order to increase frequencies to destinations that currently cannot support daily service, such as AMD, ATH, BWN, CAI, CCU, CPH, FCO, FUK, IST, JED, KWI, and RUH.

[SMK77]

Originally Posted by zvezda

I'm not sure I understand your question. LH, QF, or SQ could do so tomorrow.

If you mean when will SQ take delivery of more WhaleJets to be able to add the route on a daily basis without dropping any of the existing routes, then about March, April, or May of 2011.

While I would welcome LH and QF flying the Whalejet to Singapore, this is not planned on either side: I spoke to the Regional Manager of LH and some senior person at QF and the chances of that happening in 2011: zero.

[Pinkfloyd]

Originally Posted by SMK77

While I would welcome LH and QF flying the Whalejet to Singapore, this is not planned on either side: I spoke to the Regional Manager of LH and some senior person at QF and the chances of that happening in 2011: zero.

Aren't QF31 / 32 done on A380s?

[ycp81]

Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd

Aren't QF31 / 32 done on A380s?

Probably he meant QF and LH flying the A380 on SIN-FRA. QF will be flying A380 2x daily on SIN-LHR by early next 2011.

[Nick C]

Originally Posted by zvezda

The best available aircraft for SIN-CPH would be the A330-200. Soon it will be the 787-8. The smaller capacity would drive up RASM and allow for an increase in frequency, which would further drive up RASM. Neither seem likely to ever join SQ's fleet. :-(

30J199Y? That would be nice. Maybe A358 in due time.

[zvezda]

Originally Posted by Nick C

30J199Y? That would be nice. Maybe A358 in due time.

The 787-8 has 86.4% of the cabin floor area of the A330-300. Based just on cabin floor area and the knowledge that the 787 has a wider cabin than the A330, without checking the distances between doors, I would guess roughly 24-30J, 220-230Y.

At least for the early A350-800s, they will not be lightened from the A350-900s, only shrunk, so they cannot be expected to match the 787-8 in economics. However, Airbus are likely to later tweak the design and optimize a bunch of weight out of the A350-800. Anyway, if SQ were to order A350-800s today -- more realistically after the new year when the new CEO takes over -- then they would not be getting early production slots.

I think the 787-8 will turn out to be a better aircraft than the A350-800 -- especially on routes that are not challenging in terms of payload/range performance. In my opinion, the A350-900 and A350-1000 will be the better A350s. The A350-1000 is looking good enough that it's forced Boeing to go back to the drawing board on the excellent 777-300ER.

[B727]

Originally Posted by zvezda

I would find this much easier to believe if SQ were to operate both SIN-FRA-JFK-TPE-SIN and SIN-TPE-JFK-FRA-SIN.

I think SQ should consider using TPE as a stopover for flights to the Americas again. With direct flights between mainland China and TPE, it would make for a good alternative to HKG for mainland Chinese passengers who might want to fly SQ to the Americas.

Plus TPE has become quite the hot destination in East Asia

[solitaire]

An update on the original rumour:

SIN-AKL-SIN (SQ 286/285) will go to A380 in Northern winter 2011.

The proposed RTW flight (SIN-FRA-JFK-TPE-SIN) is now both ways and not one way. These flights will be performed by using 77W equipment.

This is from the same source as before.

[TerryK]

Originally Posted by solitaire

...SIN-AKL-SIN (SQ 286/285) will go to A380 in Northern winter 2011....

That's more than one year away.

Originally Posted by solitaire

...The proposed RTW flight (SIN-FRA-JFK-TPE-SIN) is now both ways and not one way. These flights will be performed by using 77W equipment....

That makes sense now. IMHO, one way simply won't work. Is there a rumored start date? SQ probably won't have spare 77Ws for this route until more 773s gets retrofitted to 73As. Assuming one FRA flight gets upgauged to A388; the current 77Ws for SQ325/326 can be used for this route; SQ still needs 3 additional 77Ws.